I agree. It’s not constructive to call non-techies “dumb.” Nor is it helpful to demand they”just” spend 30 min searching for solutions online. If you love tech, this is worthwhile - if you’re, say, a rights activist you’d rather spend that time reading an important report or meeting with people to advance your work; if you’re a retiree with limited means, then it might be overwhelming to “just go online”; and if you’re a musician working on an album, why should you need to spend time on tech when you could be spending that time mixing? I see examples of Linux becoming pretty user friendly compared to days of yore (eg Mint, Ubuntu), but has that improvement somehow compromised the techie side of Linux?

I see - but given that Linux isn’t one thing, couldn’t we instead see regulation of for-profit distros (or distros managed by for-profits), while volunteer-based, open-source remains largely unregulated?

I don’t see them as mutually exclusive - can’t Linux be user friendly for the non-techie while also offering a techie lots of flexibility and command-line joy? 🤷‍♂️

How do you see Linux being regulated if it grows? I imagine that Windows and MacOS are regulated because they’re for profits that e.g. harvest our data, create proprietary limitations on apps, and so on. Genuinely curious how regulating Linux would look similar - or how it might differ.

I like the prices! And europaweit lieferung - that works for me. :)

Nice to hear - and yeah, their focus on hardware for Linux is really appealing. Also, supporting a company that offers an alternative to the big players in the Windows market…

Thanks for the link - and good tip about the timing!

Thanks! :)

Well, I don’t want to have a bad time, that’s for sure…thanks for the warning. I’ll be cautious about Lenovo.

Interesting - and yet I read about many folks installing Linux on thinkpads, and those laptops even being recommended for Linux. Is it just cause so many have worked on making Lenovo be able to handle Linux?

Excellent point - guess I was just applying proprietary thinking to what Tuxedo offers, but of course it’s a different kettle of fish.

Aspire 15

Looks nice - and nice price too!

Libreboot looks very, very interesting - thanks for the tip!

Thanks for the tip - I’ll check out the AMD Acer laptops. You thinking of Nitros, in particular?

Good points all round, thanks - and I did think the Linux installation cost seemed high. I might be willing to pay a premium for good support. I’ve heard good things about System76’s customer service (but they’re US-based). Installing a distro on an old laptop doesn’t scare me - I’ve done it before. It’s more the hardware/driver issues that might arise. And then I’d love to discover an “out of the box” solution that I could recommend to my friends and family, who have little appetite for tech tinkering. Maybe that’s where Tuxedo comes into the picture…

Can’t seem to find refurbs on their website - and judging from the original announcement, they may only be available in the US and Canada (I’m in the EU).

That’s helpful, thanks. I’m guessing they charge a premium because they provide a service. I’m not afraid to tinker a bit, but my interest in Linux is not tinkering - it’s to switch to a freer, more sustainable OS. So I’m curious about services that offer support.

For that reason I’ve also looked at Tuxedo computers, but I’m worried that I’m locking myself into another company’s OS again (from Microsoft/Apple to Tuxedo) rather than having the freedom to choose my own distro. But I guess with support comes a price: less freedom.

Right now I’m deeply locked into the Apple ecosystem. Apple makes wonderful hardware and apps, but it’s still a straitjacket, even if it’s a designer straitjacket. 😀

How do you get a terminal app that’s cool and user-friendly? Any recommendations?